General Abizaid re: Nuclear Iran

[Defekted]

Abizaid: World Could Abide Nuclear Iran
By ROBERT BURNS – Sep 17, 2007

WASHINGTON (AP) — Every effort should be made to stop Iran from obtaining nuclear weapons, but failing that, the world could live with a nuclear-armed regime in Tehran, a recently retired commander of U.S. forces in the Middle East said Monday.

John Abizaid, the retired Army general who headed Central Command for nearly four years, said he was confident that if Iran gained nuclear arms, the United States could deter it from using them.

"Iran is not a suicide nation," he said. "I mean, they may have some people in charge that don't appear to be rational, but I doubt that the Iranians intend to attack us with a nuclear weapon."

The Iranians are aware, he said, that the United States has a far superior military capability.

"I believe that we have the power to deter Iran, should it become nuclear," he said, referring to the theory that Iran would not risk a catastrophic retaliatory strike by using a nuclear weapon against the United States.

"There are ways to live with a nuclear Iran," Abizaid said in remarks at the Center for Strategic and International Studies, a think tank. "Let's face it, we lived with a nuclear Soviet Union, we've lived with a nuclear China, and we're living with (other) nuclear powers as well."

He stressed that he was expressing his personal opinion and that none of his remarks were based on his previous experience with U.S. contingency plans for potential military action against Iran.

Abizaid stressed the dangers of allowing more and more nations to build a nuclear arsenal. And while he said it is likely that Iran will make a technological breakthrough to obtain a nuclear bomb, "it's not inevitable."

Iran says its nuclear program is strictly for energy resources, not to build weapons.

Abizaid suggested military action to pre-empt Iran's nuclear ambitions might not be the wisest course.

"War, in the state-to-state sense, in that part of the region would be devastating for everybody, and we should avoid it — in my mind — to every extent that we can," he said. "On the other hand, we can't allow the Iranians to continue to push in ways that are injurious to our vital interests."

He suggested that many in Iran — perhaps even some in the Tehran government — are open to cooperating with the West. The thrust of his remarks was a call for patience in dealing with Iran, which President Bush early in his first term labeled one of the "axis of evil" nations, along with North Korea and Iraq.

He said there is a basis for hope that Iran, over time, will move away from its current anti-Western stance.

Abizaid's comments appeared to represent a more accommodating and hopeful stance toward Iran than prevails in the White House, which speaks frequently of the threat posed by Iran's nuclear ambitions. The administration says it seeks a diplomatic solution to complaints about Iran's alleged support for terrorism and its nuclear program, amid persistent rumors of preparations for a U.S. military strike.

Abizaid expressed confidence that the United States and the world community can manage the Iran problem.

"I believe the United States, with our great military power, can contain Iran — that the United States can deliver clear messages to the Iranians that makes it clear to them that while they may develop one or two nuclear weapons they'll never be able to compete with us in our true military might and power," he said.

He described Iran's government as reckless, with ambitions to dominate the Middle East.

"We need to press the international community as hard as we possibly can, and the Iranians, to cease and desist on the development of a nuclear weapon and we should not preclude any option that we may have to deal with it," he said. He then added his remark about finding ways to live with a nuclear-armed Iran.

Abizaid made his remarks in response to questions from his audience after delivering remarks about the major strategic challenges in the Middle East and Central Asia — the region in which he commanded U.S. forces from July 2003 until February 2007, when he was replaced by Adm. William Fallon.

The U.S. cut diplomatic relations with Iran shortly after the 1979 storming of the U.S. Embassy in Tehran. Although both nations have made public and private attempts to improve relations, the Bush administration labeled Iran part of an "axis of evil," and Iranian leaders still refer to the United States as the Great Satan.

[Defekted]

Obviously Iran wants to be nuclear simply beause they see the example we have set to the world....

if you are a helpless regime causing trouble we will take you out (i.e. Saddam's Iraq) but if you are armed we will negotiate (i.e Korea)

Like the four star general said, they arent suicidal .... they know if they were ever to use a nuke against us or Isreal they would be wiped out.... they want the nukes so they can have security FROM us.... not attack us.

[TheHipHopBillGates]

Obviously Iran wants to be nuclear simply beause they see the example we have set to the world....

if you are a helpless regime causing trouble we will take you out (i.e. Saddam's Iraq) but if you are armed we will negotiate (i.e Korea)

Like the four star general said, they arent suicidal .... they know if they were ever to use a nuke against us or Isreal they would be wiped out.... they want the nukes so they can have security FROM us.... not attack us.

yep. I don't blame them, it's rational to want the same bargaining chips.

[jameznyhc]

yep. I don't blame them, it's rational to want the same bargaining chips.

but theyre not rational people lol

[TheHipHopBillGates]

but theyre not rational people lol

playing god again?

[jameznyhc]

playing god again?

nope just using good sound judgement , based on irans actions, behavior and culture ..i do not believe the mullahs and arminjihad is rational

[TheHipHopBillGates]

sounds like sound prejudice to me.

[jameznyhc]

sounds like sound prejudice to me.

nah prejudice is to PRE- JUDGE..my opinions are based on behavior i see.. not religion, race or color ..

[darius]

but theyre not rational people lol

hey, fuck you buddy . . . don't use "they" in the general sense . . . some might go so far as to say WE are not rational people. certainly our president and many of his cronies, in my eyes, can be considered IRRATIONAL. does that make the USA an irrational nation? iranians, in general, whether living in iran, or abroad, can be worlds more rational than you could ever conceive beyond your personal prejudice. what the fuck do you know about iranian culture? sure . . . people might be getting stoned (literally) for ridiculous reasons over there, but you won't find any mothers whoring themselves with their kids in the backseat or snorting coke of their baby's stomach.
my advice to you is to leave something which know jack shit about out of your "justifications" and paint with a much, MUCH thinner brush.

[jameznyhc]

hey, fuck you buddy . . . don't use "they" in the general sense . . . some might go so far as to say WE are not rational people. certainly our president and many of his cronies, in my eyes, can be considered IRRATIONAL. does that make the USA an irrational nation? iranians, in general, whether living in iran, or abroad, can be worlds more rational than you could ever conceive beyond your personal prejudice. what the fuck do you know about iranian culture? sure . . . people might be getting stoned (literally) for ridiculous reasons over there, but you won't find any mothers whoring themselves with their kids in the backseat or snorting coke of their baby's stomach.
my advice to you is to leave something which know jack shit about out of your "justifications" and paint with a much, MUCH thinner brush.

Sorry if i offended you darius..thats why in my next response i called out president and the mullahs.. i know the young generation who are oppressed by this goverment and jailed are not in the same mindset.. i was referring to arminijads specific outlooks and his rantings ..

As for the woman whoring herself and snorting coke off a babies stomach is repulsive .. but thats whole other issue where i feel goverment has trapped and failed a big percentage of poor americans ..from no fathers being present, drugs, welfare, etc ..there is no family system.. most poor rely on goverment and it creates a cycle that they havent been able to break ..nobodys teaching these kids values or morals..some people arent fit to be parents ..i can guarantee this whore came from a real fucked up background, and imagine if she didnt get busted ..what her kid would turn out to be like..

[TrippinFace101]

Obviously Iran wants to be nuclear simply beause they see the example we have set to the world....

if you are a helpless regime causing trouble we will take you out (i.e. Saddam's Iraq) but if you are armed we will negotiate (i.e Korea)

Like the four star general said, they arent suicidal .... they know if they were ever to use a nuke against us or Isreal they would be wiped out.... they want the nukes so they can have security FROM us.... not attack us.

I thought Iran was using there Nuclear power plant for energy purposes . God even i could have told you that yrs ago.

[darius]

Sorry if i offended you darius..thats why in my next response i called out president and the mullahs.. i know the young generation who are oppressed by this goverment and jailed are not in the same mindset.. i was referring to arminijads specific outlooks and his rantings ..

As for the woman whoring herself and snorting coke off a babies stomach is repulsive .. but thats whole other issue where i feel goverment has trapped and failed a big percentage of poor americans ..from no fathers being present, drugs, welfare, etc ..there is no family system.. most poor rely on goverment and it creates a cycle that they havent been able to break ..nobodys teaching these kids values or morals..some people arent fit to be parents ..i can guarantee this whore came from a real fucked up background, and imagine if she didnt get busted ..what her kid would turn out to be like..

no, maybe you misunderstood me . . . you don't know shit when it comes to iran. have you been closely involved with a persian family? do you have any persians that are very close friends? have you or anyone you know set foot in iran? -- THIS is what it takes to know about a culture, not the bullshit you are fed through media outlets. you don't KNOW the young generation who are oppressed anymore than you know the atmospheric density on jupiter. there are so many things that the iranian culture could offer american culture and vice versa, but you sit high atop your self-righteous pedestal and profess the greatness of american society like its right for the entire world. right now, frankly, its not . . . hell, i don't even think its right for us here. the true greatness we have lies in our dynamic to freely, and peacefully (we should hope) invoke change to this system, as i believe our forefathers genuinely intended -- to make it better, safer, more appealing and more exemplary to the rest of the world, and sadly, we are rapidly squandering that greatness vis a vis our leadershit.

[drumaboy]

Sorry if i offended you darius..thats why in my next response i called out president and the mullahs.. i know the young generation who are oppressed by this goverment and jailed are not in the same mindset.. i was referring to arminijads specific outlooks and his rantings ..

As for the woman whoring herself and snorting coke off a babies stomach is repulsive .. but thats whole other issue where i feel goverment has trapped and failed a big percentage of poor americans ..from no fathers being present, drugs, welfare, etc ..there is no family system.. most poor rely on goverment and it creates a cycle that they havent been able to break ..nobodys teaching these kids values or morals..some people arent fit to be parents ..i can guarantee this whore came from a real fucked up background, and imagine if she didnt get busted ..what her kid would turn out to be like..

at the end of the day, the man u voted for, the party u support has fucked up royally and had they not, we wouldnt be second guessing Iran today.......its been years, and still NOTHING has been done, say what you want, think what you want, its far from your hands, so, if Iran is all systems go, you have no right to complain

[jameznyhc]

no, maybe you misunderstood me . . . you don't know shit when it comes to iran. have you been closely involved with a persian family? do you have any persians that are very close friends? have you or anyone you know set foot in iran? -- THIS is what it takes to know about a culture, not the bullshit you are fed through media outlets. you don't KNOW the young generation who are oppressed anymore than you know the atmospheric density on jupiter. there are so many things that the iranian culture could offer american culture and vice versa, but you sit high atop your self-righteous pedestal and profess the greatness of american society like its right for the entire world. right now, frankly, its not . . . hell, i don't even think its right for us here. the true greatness we have lies in our dynamic to freely, and peacefully (we should hope) invoke change to this system, as i believe our forefathers genuinely intended -- to make it better, safer, more appealing and more exemplary to the rest of the world, and sadly, we are rapidly squandering that greatness vis a vis our leadershit.

I was sincere in my apology go fuck yourself ... And yes i do think we are a great society which is why so many people choose America has there refuge, We have done more to advance medicine, society, human rights, and let people CHOOSE for themselves the life they want to lead..Of course ive known persians and iranians specifically .. but what does that have to do with me not realizing Iran is helping kill american soldiers, threatens israel, denies the holocaust, hangs gay tennages, jails bloggers etc.. how can you even come close to a defense of such insanity..lol in one statement you say sure people may get stoned for rididculous reasons but theres no whores?? wtf kind of statement is that ..bro your lost ..

[jameznyhc]

at the end of the day, the man u voted for, the party u support has fucked up royally and had they not, we wouldnt be second guessing Iran today.......its been years, and still NOTHING has been done, say what you want, think what you want, its far from your hands, so, if Iran is all systems go, you have no right to complain

Lol like kerry, reid, pelosi and the democrats were going to do something?? .

[darius]

I was sincere in my apology go fuck yourself ... And yes i do think we are a great society which is why so many people choose America has there refuge, We have done more to advance medicine, society, human rights, and let people CHOOSE for themselves the life they want to lead..Of course ive known persians and iranians specifically .. but what does that have to do with me not realizing Iran is helping kill american soldiers, threatens israel, denies the holocaust, hangs gay tennages, jails bloggers etc.. how can you even come close to a defense of such insanity..lol in one statement you say sure people may get stoned for rididculous reasons but theres no whores?? wtf kind of statement is that ..bro your lost ..

what do any of those things have to do with iranian culture? i don't want or need an apology from you. you're a bigot and have proven it on more occasions than i care to count. that's all i'm saying. i don't defend the inhumanity perpetrated by the government of iran. i will defend its culture, or any culture when someone wishes to take a giant brush and paint a uniform picture of that culture based on the actions and policies of a bullish few. isn't this the very essence of the islamic fundamentalist movement -- painting with a giant brush across the length and breadth of the american (or western) culture because of the actions and policies of a few? your mindset is one and the same with them, which should sicken any of us. you should be terribly ashamed of yourself. your mentality and perception of the world are one and the same with the very filth responsible for tarnishing the image of this great nation. you prance around here claiming to be for justice and freedom for all and actually caring about humanity, but sadly, YOU are the one that's lost, terribly lost. you manifest only the same short-sighted, close-minded symptoms of the very ones you claim to hate so much -- how unamerican?!!!
anyone with an inkling of literacy can look back at my post and know where i was coming from, except you . . . why? because it doesn't serve your argument. you can only hope to pick up the fragile pieces of what you had hoped would come across as intellect, and try to put it back together and say "oh, but this is what i really meant". you're a bigot. is there still hope for you? there is always hope. you only have to be willing to abandon your prejudices, and that surely doesn't appear evident at the moment.

[Defekted]

"but theyre not rational people lol, just using good sound judgement , based on irans actions, behavior and culture"


You deserve every word from Darius post Jamez.

It is something I have stressed time and time again..... Yes I have called you a racist several times, which i shouldnt but sometimes you just need a smack to wake up....

you love to generalize, to stereotype..... from Iranians to Palestinians to Lebanese to muslims in general....

you take the acts of a few and you barrage the forum with it..... with the clear intent to get people to start formulating the idea that this type of stuff is rampant and is symbolic of their culture and their religion....

WHICH IT IS NOT.

Until you eat, drink, dance, laugh, and cry with a people you will never know the people. Your heart and mind seems to have made up a decision and you stubbornly stick to it without knowing the people you are trying to persecute. Thats sad. Never assume anything, especially when your sources have a biased agenda that promotes the intolerance and violence that you accuse the other side of promoting..... the irony is shocking.

I think you are a good kid to tell you the honest truth. I dont think anyone here is bad per se, but you seem to get caught up in negative emotions more so than anyone else. And sometimes that comes across really bad, to the point at times where its intolerant and racist. You would change your tune as most people do once you interact with the people you perceive to be evildoers.... youll soon realize that the vast majority have the same aspirations as you - family, business, success, security.....

first step is to back away from the hate filled, fear invoking tabloids that you take for gospel

[ShaE]

but theyre not rational people lol

BUT IT IS rational to want the capabilities for weapons and power that others have.

[ShaE]

there are so many things that the iranian culture could offer american culture and vice versa, but you sit high atop your self-righteous pedestal and profess the greatness of american society like its right for the entire world. right now, frankly, its not . . . hell, i don't even think its right for us here. the true greatness we have lies in our dynamic to freely, and peacefully (we should hope) invoke change to this system, as i believe our forefathers genuinely intended -- to make it better, safer, more appealing and more exemplary to the rest of the world, and sadly, we are rapidly squandering that greatness vis a vis our leadershit.

I believe part of our strength has come from our diversity in allowing us to assimilate and adopt pieces of immigrants' cultures and make it our own. We are not the only ones w/ good to offer and we could be well served by learning from others, not persecuting them and preaching to them about superiority.

On point man, 100%.

[ShaE]

Like the four star general said, they arent suicidal .... they know if they were ever to use a nuke against us or Isreal they would be wiped out.... they want the nukes so they can have security FROM us.... not attack us.

1 100% guarantee if we were all having this discussion during the cold war jamez would advocate using the bomb on the soviets, or war. The same arguments were made then, the same bull about "appeasement", "can't negotiate w/ them" bull, yet rational people maintained that neither us nor the soviets were suicidal. Nobody wanted nuclear war, and we squeaked by in a much more difficult situation. It would serve some people well to study history and THINK a bit instead of regurgitating the nightly news propaganda for some perspective.